Docker support in Proxmox

LnxBil

Well-Known Member
Feb 21, 2015
4,217
408
83
Germany
I think supporting native docker will give Proxmox another boost, because it already can use LXC and KVM.
 
  • Like
Reactions: kilasat

aik.fiend

New Member
Jul 28, 2014
12
1
1
I think supporting native docker will give Proxmox another boost, because it already can use LXC and KVM.
It's really good feature, therefore I'm asking about it. Once Proxmox droped OpenVZ and started using LXC, may be it's time to add native docker support?

Tom, may be Dietmar need to look at this post.
I can help with coding.
 

fireon

Well-Known Member
Oct 25, 2010
3,067
194
63
Austria/Graz
iteas.at
There I'am different opinion. I know docker, yes. And it is an nice technology. But i would find it better to have the focus on stabilize furthermore KVM and LXC.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Feni and dlasher

thesubmitter

Member
Jun 5, 2012
60
9
8
docker is the defacto standard in containerization, at my company there is strong push from developers to go to a docker based infrastructure.... at this point it inevitably leades me away from proxmox which I have been using for so many years. Please add native support for docker containers (not inside KVM)
 
  • Like
Reactions: aloyr and MeGaPk

wosp

Member
Apr 18, 2015
202
22
18
32
The Netherlands
However I'm not planning to use it myself currently, I agree. I think adding Docker support is a nice feature for PVE, because I think Docker will be the no. 1 choice when it comes to containers for lots of people (however if I was using containers, I think I would prefer LXC. But Docker simply have a good reputation and is well known, I think better known than LXC).
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Th3Dan

locusofself

Member
Mar 29, 2016
39
3
8
35
I'm going to find out what happens if I just install Docker on one of my bare-metal proxmox hosts, by adding the Debian Jessie apt repository and just installing it that way..

I know it would be a safer move to just run it in a KVM guest, but bare metal performance would be great to get more bang for the buck from a proxmox host .. bad idea? Who knows
 

RobFantini

Well-Known Member
May 24, 2012
1,643
27
48
Boston,Mass
I'm going to find out what happens if I just install Docker on one of my bare-metal proxmox hosts, by adding the Debian Jessie apt repository and just installing it that way..

I know it would be a safer move to just run it in a KVM guest, but bare metal performance would be great to get more bang for the buck from a proxmox host .. bad idea? Who knows
have you tried LXC? It is very fast .

since the 90's we have used vservers, then openvz and now lxc. they are all close to bare metal speed. LXC looks to be future proof as no special kernel is needed.
 

alexskysilk

Active Member
Oct 16, 2015
595
62
28
Chatsworth, CA
www.skysilk.com
Before pounding the table for docker support, it may be worthwhile to mention that Proxmox's LXC implementation still doesnt support failover, making it of limited value vs virtualized containerization. Since docker works in QEMU, it is probably preferable.

Seriously guys, I know this is hard but its really a critical feature. It is much harder to control layer 3 in a KVM VM then in a container.
 

locusofself

Member
Mar 29, 2016
39
3
8
35
have you tried LXC? It is very fast .

since the 90's we have used vservers, then openvz and now lxc. they are all close to bare metal speed. LXC looks to be future proof as no special kernel is needed.
Yep, I'm using a few LXC machines on Proxmox it is very cool. But What I am asking is if I can also run Docker on the host O.S. (Proxmox).

LXC and Docker are both Linux container technologies, but they have different purposes. LXC is usually used for system containers, like a normal VPS, a system you would run and log into and all of that. Docker containers are generally programmatic and run, do something, exit, like an application, and Docker has a whole set of tooling around building, distributing and running these application contrainers. I realize there is some overlap in the functionality of LXC vs Docker, but in general what I'm saying is the case.

Since I have a limited # of bare metal servers, it would be cool for them to be able to do double-duty as Proxmox hosts and Docker hosts, both on bare metal.



Edit: Also, it's been said that Docker doesn't run well (or at all) INSIDE LXC.

SO you can run Docker inside a KVM machine no problem of course but then it's not bare metal.

Running Docker inside LXC I've read it problematic, at least with the default configurations of Proxmox and Docker .. ?


Regards,

Kevin Long
 
  • Like
Reactions: dlasher

RobFantini

Well-Known Member
May 24, 2012
1,643
27
48
Boston,Mass
.... It is much harder to control layer 3 in a KVM VM then in a container.
Hello
trying to learn more here... could you give an example of ' control layer 3' ? like which service or application could use it. ( I've read about network layers but do not yet fully understand the concept.)
 

alexskysilk

Active Member
Oct 16, 2015
595
62
28
Chatsworth, CA
www.skysilk.com
But What I am asking is if I can also run Docker on the host O.S.
Yes and no. Docker is outside of Proxmox's scope (at least today,) BUT there is nothing stopping you from installing Docker on a proxmox node- you'll just have no exposure of its management through Proxmox's GUI or API. You will not have any node fault tolerance (which is also true for LXC,) and you will also have to contend with competing system load from Proxmox and Docker, which do not know about each other's existence.

SO you can run Docker inside a KVM machine no problem of course but then it's not bare metal.
Depending on your use case this may not be a problem. On the upside, you gain cluster failover capability.

RobFantini said:
could you give an example of ' control layer 3' ? like which service or application could use it.
OSI model Layer 3 refers to functionality at the IP address level. In other words, if you wanted to set or change an IP address using the Proxmox API, thats a very simple operation for a container; To do the same with a VM is a far more complicated operation and requires third party tools or custom scripts.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Feni and RobFantini

thesubmitter

Member
Jun 5, 2012
60
9
8
It would be cool if proxmox was integrated with kubernetes (the defacto standard for docker orchestration)..... there is openshift too

Right now I am planning out how we are going to roll out docker in our enterprise.

It's going to go something like this

Phase 1 . Proxmox/KVM/Debian (or CoreOS)/Kubernetes
Phase 2. Proxmox/LXC/Debian (or CoreOS)/Kubernetes

There is a shift in tech world where developers are king and you need to provide a platform for self-service deployments via docker pretty much.
 

dietmar

Proxmox Staff Member
Staff member
Apr 28, 2005
16,503
320
83
Austria
www.proxmox.com
It would be cool if proxmox was integrated with kubernetes (the defacto standard for docker orchestration).....
Docker and kubernetes run perfectly inside a VM, so there is no real value to integrate that into proxmox itself.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Feni

alexskysilk

Active Member
Oct 16, 2015
595
62
28
Chatsworth, CA
www.skysilk.com
Docker and kubernetes run perfectly inside a VM, so there is no real value to integrate that into proxmox itself.
That actually made me laugh. By that logic, what is the value that proxmox offer docker users at all? Since, by design, Docker is replacing the hypervisor all Proxmox is doing is adding an unnecessary abstraction layer to the metal. Its not really my business but you may want to listen to your users- containerization is replacing the hypervisor, and if you dont adapt your product will become obsolete.

to the op and others- unless/until the Proxmox team decide to move in the direction of docker, have a look at docker swarm.
 

thesubmitter

Member
Jun 5, 2012
60
9
8
The value is having a single GUI/Management tool to control all your virtualization stack. Openstack is kind of doing this...

I really have to agree also with the last poster....

Right now we are in the midst of a revolution - docker is pretty much taking over and is the developers preferred tool.

Proxmox is GREAT and has always been great but I feel like Proxmox which was AHEAD of the containerization wave by making openvz easily manageable is now falling behind by not integrating the next new platform.

Proxmox: KVM | LXC | Docker

It would completely dominate the market as it can manage all 3 type of platforms.

The fact that kubernetes is there to manage all the docker scheduling and is open source etc.... means that you have the almost all the management APIs already there and "just" need to integrate into the proxmox GUI.... Look at what openshift is doing... gravy on top of the core tool

In 5 years from now when dockerization of apps is the major way we virtualize I would like proxmox to offer the full stack virtualization.
 

About

The Proxmox community has been around for many years and offers help and support for Proxmox VE and Proxmox Mail Gateway. We think our community is one of the best thanks to people like you!

Get your subscription!

The Proxmox team works very hard to make sure you are running the best software and getting stable updates and security enhancements, as well as quick enterprise support. Tens of thousands of happy customers have a Proxmox subscription. Get your own in 60 seconds.

Buy now!