[SOLVED] PVE ISO vs Debian PVE via APT install

[Deleted member 205422]

I have followed both the standard ISO install (8.0.4) and tried to install another node manually (with custom partitioning) on top of Debian network install with very much nothing else than wget (even skipped system tools in tasksel) and ZFS.

The resulting size of the ISO-sourced install (ZFS) has the size of used space on root 2.1G;
meanwhile the Debian-based APT install is 3.6G.

Both have been upgraded to the latest debian packages, anyhow I went to check what extras I got in the Debian manual-on-top-install and sure enough there are some libraries I could remove, BUT there are also lots of missing packages that were included in the PVE ISO install, namely:

< apt-listchanges
< bash-completion
< bc
< bind9-dnsutils
< bind9-host
< bind9-libs:amd64
< bsdextrautils
< btrfs-progs
< debian-faq
< doc-debian
< eject
< fdutils
< fonts-lato
< grub-pc-bin
< inetutils-telnet
< krb5-locales
< ksm-control-daemon
< libdouble-conversion3:amd64
< libfile-find-rule-perl
< libfstrm0:amd64
< libjemalloc2:amd64
< liblinear4:amd64
< liblttng-ust-common1:amd64
< liblttng-ust-ctl5:amd64
< liblttng-ust1:amd64
< libmaxminddb0:amd64
< libnss-systemd:amd64
< libnumber-compare-perl
< libpcap0.8:amd64
< libpcre2-16-0:amd64
< libpcre3:amd64
< libpipeline1:amd64
< libqt5core5a:amd64
< libqt5dbus5:amd64
< libqt5network5:amd64
< librdkafka1:amd64
< librgw2
< libruby:amd64
< libruby3.1:amd64
< libtext-glob-perl
< libthrift-0.17.0:amd64
< libuv1:amd64
< lsof
< lua-lpeg:amd64
< mailcap
< man-db
< memtest86+
< mime-support
< msr-tools
< netcat-traditional
< nmap
< nmap-common
< procmail
< pve-kernel-6.2.16-3-pve
< python3-debconf
< python3-debian
< python3-debianbts
< python3-httplib2
< python3-pycurl
< python3-pyparsing
< python3-pysimplesoap
< python3-reportbug
< python3-rgw
< rake
< reportbug
< ruby
< ruby-net-telnet
< ruby-rubygems
< ruby-sdbm:amd64
< ruby-webrick
< ruby-xmlrpc
< ruby3.1
< rubygems-integration
< spl
< ssh
< strace
< systemd-boot
< systemd-boot-efi:amd64
< tcpdump
< time
< traceroute
< unzip
< usrmerge
< zfs-initramfs
< zip

Why are all these packages needed, or are they?

 

[Deleted member 205422]

Does anyone know if they python and ruby is needed for anything in the default ISO install?

 

[LnxBil]

Does anyone know if they python and ruby is needed for anything in the default ISO install?

No, PVE is written in Perl, so any other programming language is NOT required. Try to remove the packages as you like, it's just a Debian-based OS, so do what you need to do, we do the same.

 

[Deleted member 205422]

No, PVE is written in Perl, so any other programming language is NOT required. Try to remove the packages as you like, it's just a Debian-based OS, so do what you need to do, we do the same.

Thanks, that's the thing though, they were not in my minimal Debian netinstall, why included it in the ISO then...

 

[fabian]

because some of the packages you list require them, and they are installed via the ISO for convenience sake (e.g., having tcpdump and nmap and strace and traceroute installed is valuable when debugging some issue, where you - in that moment - might not be able to install additional packages)

the only thing that jumps out that probably should be added to the dep tree of our packages somewhere is "ssh", but it seems both variants include the server and client anyway, so it's not strictly needed.

 

[Deleted member 205422]

because some of the packages you list require them, and they are installed via the ISO for convenience sake (e.g., having tcpdump and nmap and strace and traceroute installed is valuable when debugging some issue, where you - in that moment - might not be able to install additional packages)

The mentioned ones by you, I don't have any issue with, after all I admitted I skipped everything but sshd in tasksel, but:

root@pve5:~# apt-cache depends --installed ruby3.1
ruby3.1
  Depends: rubygems-integration
  Depends: libc6
  Depends: libcrypt1
  Depends: libgmp10
  Depends: libruby3.1
  Depends: zlib1g
  Recommends: fonts-lato
  Recommends: libjs-jquery
root@pve5:~# apt-cache depends --installed libruby3.1
libruby3.1
  Depends: rake
  Depends: ruby-net-telnet
  Depends: ruby-xmlrpc
  Depends: ruby-webrick
  Depends: ruby-sdbm
  Depends: libc6
  Depends: libcrypt1
  Depends: libedit2
  Depends: libffi8
  Depends: libgmp10
  Depends: libncurses6
  Depends: libssl3
  Depends: libtinfo6
  Depends: libyaml-0-2
  Depends: zlib1g
root@pve5:~# apt-cache depends --installed ruby-net-telnet
ruby-net-telnet

Why do I need that is it there, for example (it came with the PVE ISO)?

... or more intriguingly, WEBrick? And others.

 

[fabian]

the python parts are pulled in by ceph and reportbug (I didn't check all of them, possibly also by other things). ruby is not installed by default when installing via the ISO, maybe it got pulled in on upgrade via a recommended relation? in that case, the apt history log should tell you.. the ruby packages don't even exist on the ISO

from your list of differing packages, the following are not on the ISO at all and thus also not present after a fresh install, neither with nor without running `apt update; apt full-upgrade` afterwards.

fonts-lato: missing
msr-tools: missing
unzip: missing
rake: missing
ruby: missing
ruby-net-telnet: missing
ruby-rubygems: missing
ruby-sdbm:amd64: missing
ruby-webrick: missing
ruby-xmlrpc: missing
ruby3.1: missing
rubygems-integration: missing

 

[Deleted member 205422]

I am so sorry. ‍

Start-Date: 2023-10-31  20:13:19
Commandline: apt install i7z
Install: ruby-sdbm:amd64 (1.0.0-5+b1, automatic), i7z:amd64 (0.27.2+git2013.10.12-g5023138-8), zip:amd64 (3.0-13, automatic), fonts-lato:amd64 (2.0-2.1, automatic), libruby:amd64 (1:3.1, automatic), ruby-net-telnet:amd64 (0.2.0-1, automatic), rubygems-integration:amd64 (1.18, automatic), libruby3.1:amd64 (3.1.2-7, automatic), rake:amd64 (13.0.6-3, automatic), msr-tools:amd64 (1.3-5, automatic), ruby:amd64 (1:3.1, automatic), ruby3.1:amd64 (3.1.2-7, automatic), unzip:amd64 (6.0-28, automatic), ruby-rubygems:amd64 (3.3.15-2, automatic), ruby-xmlrpc:amd64 (0.3.2-2, automatic), ruby-webrick:amd64 (1.8.1-1, automatic)
End-Date: 2023-10-31  20:13:33

As I was troubleshooting mysterious freezes, I needed to see C-states, then I got identical hardware and went on to swap RAM modules, then I swapped disks too, in the process I forgot this was a new hardware but not fresh install (the node that was then got the debian install). Finally, I missed it because it got into log.1 which I overlooked (as I thought it was new install).

Apologies again. Thanks for double-checking.

 

[fabian]

no worries!