Proxmox with Freenas ZFS RAIDZ

B

boun

Guest
Hello,

I want to make freenas wm input proxmox with raiddz disks

If i configure raidz in freenas so if i don't configure it on proxmox, is it good for raidz performance.

Or i did to configure raidz in proxmox ?

Thk

ps: I'm french :rolleyes:
 
Hello,

I want to make freenas wm input proxmox with raiddz disks

If i configure raidz in freenas so if i don't configure it on proxmox, is it good for raidz performance.

Or i did to configure raidz in proxmox ?

Thk

ps: I'm french :rolleyes:
Hi,
pve need an disk (real or iScsi/FC-SAN) or an nfs-mount. So you can choose which you wan't to support with your freenaz-fileserver.
Raidz must be created on the freenas-box.

Udo
 
Proxmox is configured into à sata disk with my vm.

I wante to use other disk in feenas vm with ZFS ?

Is it possible, can i make ZFS configuration in proxmox ?
 
Proxmox is configured into à sata disk with my vm.

I wante to use other disk in feenas vm with ZFS ?

Is it possible, can i make ZFS configuration in proxmox ?
Hi,
pve is linux-based and ZFS has an gpl-incompatible license - there will no zfs on linux (normaly - you can build for your own, or use userland-mount but this is slow).
FreeNAS and friends are normaly for bare-metal installation and not for virtualisation (it's make perhaps no sense because of speed and so on) e.g. should run on a dedicated machine.

Udo
 
Thx,

I think i'm virtualize a debian for my nas and use pmdam for logicial raid.

Best regards
 
i use a similar solution at home! proxmox & a kvm running ubuntu with zfs-fuse! it's slow like on a physical machine! ;-)
the disks are attached to the kvm via the config file, so i see the physical disk in my kvm! and over them i created the data pool!

unfortunately there are no Solaris virtio driver available :-( but would be the best solution for me!
 
I've got a box that I use for storage and also for virtualised servers.
I installed proxmox on one HDD, then installed a FreeNAS VM in KVM.
I have 2 more disks that I didn't assign to proxmox but left as is; I configured the FreeNAS VM in Proxmox to use them.

Yes, FreeNAS is virtualised which might hurt performance, but my data is stored twice :)
 
Hi,

i want to do the same.

I have a 64GB SSD attached to my onboard Controller with PROXMOX installed.
In addition, I have two SATA Drives on the same onboard Controller.

I installed FreeNAS-8 as a VM on my local Space (SSD).
In the Config-File i added:
ide1: /dev/sdb
ide2: /dev/sdc

Now i can use the two SATA-Drives in FreeNAS for ZFS-Raid (mirror) and make a NFS Share which can be used from PROXMOX.

My Question now:
Is there an advantage if I have an additional SATA controller for the two Drives which i directly passthrough to the FreeNAS-VM?


Alex
 
I can use ZFS with FreeNAS-8 too - i wrote.

But when i install a VM at the NFS-Share, the Speed is not good, i think the reason is that there is no virtio-driver available for freebsd (FreeNAS).


Alex
 
trendco, the speed isn't good because you have many "extra" layers, not because of the lack of a virtio driver for freebsd. What you are doing is fine to test and play with, but if you want to use it for anything serious, it's pointless and really not a good idea at all...

Everyone in this thread running some kind of NAS as a virtual machine should read below, otherwise I will simply say I told you so, and you will feel like an idiot when all your data is lost...

First of all, you shouldn't virtualize your file-server if you expect any performance out of it. It would be faster if you ran the 2 SATA drives directly under Proxmox. Most modern motherboards support doing a RAID 1 setup (mirroring) with no extra hardware, which will store your data twice and it will be much faster. Not only that, but if your FreeNAS virtual machine is stored on your SSD, then your system still relies on that single point of failure, if that drive breaks, then your precious 2 copies are not accessible any more, which defeats the purpose of having a RAID array... ALSO, ZFS requires a lot of RAM, plus you are virtualizing FreeNAS which needs additional RAM too, so if you simply want to have your data on 2 drives, you're better of with RAID-1.

I get the feeling everyone thinks their data is safer because it's mirrored, but the whole point of RAID-1 (mirroring) is to have 2 copies of all the data, 1 copy per hard drive, so that in the case of one hard drive failing, the system can continue to run without shutting down. It's used to avoid downtime. It is not meant to be used as a backup solution... Yes you have 2 copies of everything, but to the system the RAID array appears as a single disk. If you were moving files around on your RAID-1 array, and accidentally deleted a folder, then that folder will be deleted from BOTH hard drives at the same time. If you don't have a backup copy of that folder somewhere else, your data is lost forever... So as you can see, RAID-1 only protects your data from hardware failure, not accidental user error nor data corruption, which is why you should be making regular backupsAND testing them to make sure they actually work, even if you have a RAID setup. I can't stress that enough.


What you are doing is fine if you just want to experiment with FreeNAS and Proxmox you'll be able to get them talking and see how it works, but as soon as you think your data is in any way safer, you are unknowingly putting your data at a much higher risk of loosing forever... I hope my explanation is understandable, and sheds some light on your setup, I would hate to see you loose all your data.

-Slopes
 
Slopes,

Good post with which I mostly agree: mirroring is not backup. However, as you also point out, it can mitigate the effects of (single) disk failure).

Edit: realized the thread was about ZFS; the stuff below will be a bit off-topic as I'm not using ZFS...

In my situation, I'm glad to have the trade-off of my NAS OS virtualized with 2 mirrored raw disks (=RAID1 ;) ) used by the NAS over having to set up and maintain samba,nfs,ftp,etc on my Proxmox box which I try to keep as clean as possible. Yes, I might lose a couple of %, but the physical box is not CPU or memory bound yet, so I don't care really.
Also in my case, if the Proxmox disk or the FreeNAS box breaks, I can (ok should be able to, haven't yet tested it) recover the data on the mirror because it's a standard FreeBSD mirror using ufs.

As for backups & tests: I copy over my data over a VPN to a remote fileserver and write the occasional DVD with important documents. While some sort of automation here (using e.g. rsync+snapshots) might be handy, I'm fairly comfortable with this.

You mentioned significant RAM overhead for ZFS... I might keep that in mind when deciding my upgrade path from my old FreeNAS install, thanks.

As for using motherboard RAID instead of Linux/FreeBSD software RAID... well, to each his own I guess.

Anyway, thanks for your altruistic post - it will warn people on what to expect and you helped me because of the ZFS RAM warning...
 
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JimBeam, you definitely seem to know what you are doing, and I definitely agree it's way better to keep the Proxmox host lean and clean. I also think it's not always a bad idea to run a NAS OS as a VM, especially for the convienience of all the file services under one box.

I just thought those guys where getting all gung-ho about having a RAID setup, but were missing that they still rely on a single hard drive and maybe even worse not making any other backups...!

Just for the record, I'm not saying it's better to use the motherboard RAID, just that it could provide the 2 copies of everything he was talking about while removing a layer of abstraction. Proxmox could also be run off that, so if a drive failed the server could keep running and they wouldn't have to reinstall Proxmox + NAS VM to access their files again. I personally use ZFS, with RAID-Z on a FreeNAS box, but on a dedicated machine... I had some money to spend :)

ZFS does use more RAM but it's not terrible, the mirroring isn't actually that bad, it's more the RAID-Z that really needs it, but it uses it for good features, doesn't just waste it :)
 

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