Proxmox VE - Support Lifecycle

Discussion in 'Proxmox VE: Installation and configuration' started by martin, Jul 17, 2017.

  1. martin

    martin Proxmox Staff Member
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    How long will my Proxmox VE version be supported?

    Proxmox VE versions are supported at least as long as the corresponding Debian Version is oldstable. Proxmox VE uses a rolling release model and using the latest stable version is always recommended.

    Proxmox VE 5.x
    First Release: 2017-07, Debian Version 9 (Stretch), Debian EOL: tba, Proxmox VE EOL: tba

    Proxmox VE 4.x
    First Release: 2015-10, Debian Version 8 (Jessie), Debian EOL: 2018-06, Proxmox VE EOL: 2018-06

    Proxmox VE 3.x
    First Release: 2013-05, Debian Version 7 (Wheezy), Debian EOL: 2016-04, Proxmox VE EOL: 2017-02

    Proxmox VE 2.x
    First Release: 2012-04, Debian Version 6 (Squeeze), Debian EOL: 2014-05, Proxmox VE EOL: 2014-05

    Proxmox VE 1.x
    First Release: 2008-10, Debian Version 5 (Lenny), Debian EOL: 2012-03, Proxmox VE EOL: 2013-01

    __________________

    Best regards,

    Martin Maurer
    Proxmox VE project leader
     
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  2. mac.linux.free

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    Thank you. Good work.

    How cloud I upgrade from 3.4 to 5.0 beacuse of the DRBD 8.x module?
    It is a paid installation with 3 PM's.

    Thanks for help.
     
  3. tom

    tom Proxmox Staff Member
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    As this question is not directly related to thread topic, pls open a new thread with a suitable thread name.
     
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  4. rafman

    rafman New Member
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    Are there any plans for an LTS Version? Debian now supports every release as an LTS-Version, and this very fast paced Support Life cycle of Proxmox is pretty hard to follow in a mission-critical environment.
     
  5. tom

    tom Proxmox Staff Member
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    There is no such plan. Please note, Debian LTS covers only a subset of packages and does not mean that all packages needed for Proxmox VE are maintained.

    In-place upgrading from 4.x to 5.x is well supported and could be done in most cases without downtime in a cluster. We expect a similar situation for 6.x - so it makes no sense to force users to run outdated installations (LTS versions).
     
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  6. rafman

    rafman New Member
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    I hope so, but currently an upgrade is not possible as Ceph is not stable yet. However Upgrades always carry the risk of something breaking, therefore I don't like to upgrade unless it's really really necessary.
    Why risk ruining everything when everything is working smoothly? I don't seem the only one thinking that way as Debian LTS, Ubuntu LTS, Xenserver, RHEL/CentOS etc. all have very long support life cycles.

    It would be nice to have a ~5 year support range for Proxmox as well, so you usually don't need to upgrade with the same hardware.

    I really like Proxmox and we plan to use it more, however the support lifecycle is major concern. If there is a package missing in Debian LTS, they do have a list which packages to prioritize. We could vote for those packages, so they might get included in the LTS support.
     
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  7. tom

    tom Proxmox Staff Member
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    Upgrading a host is not "risk ruining everything" - if you are familiar with the process is just running a few commands, of course, you should test this in test lab and you should also have valid backups. I personally did a lot of upgrades from 4.x and to 5.x recently. Ceph 12.0 will be stable soon, so you can also plan Ceph upgrades later this year.

    I know that others do up to 10 year support, but in reality LTS means just they do not touch anything because its LTS - so do not be believe all this LTS promises from big vendors with digging deeper. LTS is always just for a subset of packages. Our approach - up to 3 years - is the best schedule for Proxmox VE.
     
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  8. rafman

    rafman New Member
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    Well, that's exactly what I mean. We cannot afford to re-build an infrastructure for 50k+ just to test an upgrade. And the test environment is never the same as the live one. If the process is not risky, why is this necessary?

    That's exactly what most people expect from LTS, including me. Why would I want changes if everything runs smoothly? LTS is supposed to stay exactly the same, except for serious issues and serious security flaws. Just think about it, maybe an LTS version would help Proxmox grow, something I would really like to see, even without generating that much work on your side.
     
  9. Don Daniello

    Don Daniello New Member

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    I will be happy to sell you "LTS" version so you can continue using the same Proxmo version for 20 more years (as if I could prevent you from doing so...). Just remember that I don't actually plan on doing anything for you (besides sending an invoice). But everything is working smoothly for you and you want it to stay EXACTLY the same, so I think it's a great deal!
     
  10. Stefano Giunchi

    Stefano Giunchi New Member
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    I second rafman, an LTS version should be offered.
    I buy/sell servers with 5-yr warranty extension, and the software support should at least be equal.
    The only wanted updates are security and bugs, not new features.

    I would be happy to receive only an invoice and nothing else, what I ask is that if I have a problem with an unsupported version I must be certain to not receive the answer "call me back when you upgraded everything" (I know it never happens, but there are customers which want it written).

    I should not be forced to upgrade perfectly working software, much more so with Ceph in the system: a node upgrade means I need to set "noout", so I don't have Ceph rebalancing in case of a disk fault, while upgrading.
    If I have a 10-nodes cluster, it's a problem.
     
  11. mailinglists

    mailinglists Member

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  12. PLE

    PLE New Member

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    I have to agree here. At least the subscription based Enterprise version should support both LTS (currently Jessie) and Extended LTS (currently Wheezy).

    The reality is actually different. Both Debian 8 LTS and Debian 7 Extended LTS have in many cases better security support then Debian 9.

    For example, CVE-2018-0737 in OpenSSL. Fixed in Debian 7 last week, Debian 8 today, and still vulnerable on Debian 9. Another example is MariaDB which has right now 21 security issues in Debian 9 and was last time updated 1 year ago, while the Debian 8 package was updated last month.

    You can always sponsor the LTS/Extended LTS version if something is missing: https://www.freexian.com/services/debian-lts.html
     
  13. sebschmidt1981

    sebschmidt1981 New Member

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    Hey guys,
    first of all, this has nothing to do, with the topic of the creator. The topic is for transparency, who doesnt love that?!
    Second i agree a stable system is much to be favored, BUT if you just dont want to upgrade, just dont do it, PVE doesnt forces you to upgrade anything. On the other hand, if you only could bring every 5 years a new pve version with new features we would still be in early 3.X with openVZ containers instead of LXC. Sometimes you guys have to think beyond the obvious, think about technology, features to be added, new / better ways of doing programming and so on. Long story short, i agree with the thread opener,3 years is more then enough, just dont update if you only want to do it anyway every 5 years, where Moores Law hits you and you buy a new server system. Dont stop the progress of this awesome solution by forcing them to do something they and maybe we dont want!
     
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  14. Stefano Giunchi

    Stefano Giunchi New Member
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    It does, if you want a supported system. And most customers want it and pay for it.
     
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