StelfServer / Home server with transparent VM

[DrNickDoom]

Hi, I'm looking to sneak a server into my mum's house, to make it easier for me to manage things for her and hopefully consolidatie a clutter in her TV cabinet and desk.

Setting up a server to do what it needs to should not be a problem but… I've tried adding a lower server befor and it always ends up with me being asked why something isn't working and when Coming round to fix it the server was turned off as she “wasn't using it” (a similar problem happens when the Wi-Fi stops working upstairs, undoubtedly she's turned off the mesh router up there)

I was wondering if there was a way I could have a proxmox server running a VM and have it present to her as its the pc.
So the main video output, the front IO usb power buttons ect, keyboard/mouse and the DVD would all be passed thought to the VM.

So from my mum's point of view it's just her PC that she can use as she likes and she can even turn it on and off as she's likes without effecting the server.

I'm thinking it's basically just passing things though but can I do that with the power button?

I was also wondering if there is a name this type of setup as I know it's not a new idea but my Google foo fails me so I'm probably calling it the wrong thing.

Sorry if this is a bit vague or if it's not on topic I didn't know where to ask and as I plan on a proxmox server I thought this community would definitely know.

I Can post the specs if the likely Pc of be using and what i will be running if needed but thought i would ask more generally 1st

thanks in advance for any input

 

[LnxBil]

In general this works and I also tried to do that with a laptop for a coworker, but in the end a lot of stuff just didn't work reliable or at all. The power button can be reprogramed (at least the single press, not the long-press).

To offer another solution for your problem:
Have you considered running a background VM on the your mothers PC, that automatically gets started and stopped with the normal OS? You could then do your stuff from there.

 

[Dunuin]

So from my mum's point of view it's just her PC that she can use as she likes and she can even turn it on and off as she's likes without effecting the server.

Wouldn't she then always shutdown the whole server to save some power once she finishes working with the "PC"?

So the main video output, the front IO usb power buttons ect, keyboard/mouse and the DVD would all be passed thought to the VM.

If that is possible depends on the hardware. Would require to make use of PCI passthrough to passthroug the GPU and maybe a USB controller card in case you don't make use USB passthrough. DVD isn't that easy. Should work with data DVDs but getting something like movie playback working was hard if I remember right because of the copy protections of the movie industry.

 

[DrNickDoom]

In general this works and I also tried to do that with a laptop for a coworker, but in the end a lot of stuff just didn't work reliable or at all. The power button can be reprogramed (at least the single press, not the long-press).

thanks for letting me know you experience trying this. While both would probably mean i should not do it, out of curiosity was the it the VM experiences that was reliable or did it make the host system less reliable?

To offer another solution for your problem:
Have you considered running a background VM on the your mothers PC, that automatically gets started and stopped with the normal OS? You could then do your stuff from there.

This is probably the more sensible/normal way to do this was looking to use proxmox as a stable base, compared to the windows environment my mum will need, I don't trust a windows PC to have expectable uptime( the hope is to among other things to replace her CCTV box and run a Home assistant instance to centralises her iot things to one place, among other things)
I had originally planed use a 2nd PC but like the idea of consolidating as much in to one box

Spoiler

not relevant but had written out a bit about why she needed windows
for what's she does there would not have a problem with a linux os her old laptop ended it life on kubuntu she actually complained I had moved things around again when her current one had windows on it, Had a problem with them before with a Text document they refused to take anything from LibreOffice they said they wanted it in "microsoft" even though my mum had saved it in .docx, bought a copy MsOffice still refused it saying it did not work ended up being they were using word 97, and I felt stupid for not trying a .doc

Wouldn't she then always shutdown the whole server to save some power once she finishes working with the "PC"?

the hope was she would shut down the VM the host is basically silent and would hopefully have no LEDs ect on and look off when even when the host was on if the VM was off. She doesn't really do it to save power more just she puts things away when she is finished with them, and for electronics that means off.

If that is possible depends on the hardware. Would require to make use of PCI passthrough to passthroug the GPU and maybe a USB controller card in case you don't make use USB passthrough. DVD isn't that easy. Should work with data DVDs but getting something like movie playback working was hard if I remember right because of the copy protections of the movie industry.

the DVD was going to be for to play her DVDs had not though about copy protections braking it thanks for the heads up.



Thanks for the the Input,
looks like i had the right idea about what i would need to do, but that its probably not the best idea, i will still probably give it a try but will sort something different for my mum.

 

[LnxBil]

thanks for letting me know you experience trying this. While both would probably mean i should not do it, out of curiosity was the it the VM experiences that was reliable or did it make the host system less reliable?

WIFI was a big problem and general stability with PCIe passthrough which changed from kernel to kernel. We also tried different laptops in order to get PCIe passthrough better. Most hardware was not built for it. This does not mean that it can't be done, but involves a LOT of work to get a combination of stuff that will work. Personally, I stopped using PCIe passthrough after this due to more problems than gain.

This is probably the more sensible/normal way to do this was looking to use proxmox as a stable base, compared to the windows environment my mum will need, I don't trust a windows PC to have expectable uptime( the hope is to among other things to replace her CCTV box and run a Home assistant instance to centralises her iot things to one place, among other things)
I had originally planed use a 2nd PC but like the idea of consolidating as much in to one box

Depending on what you actually need: what about installing a "new router", that is OpenWRT-based with a bigger flash or even USB and jumpfrom this to whereever you need to go?

 

[Dunuin]

the hope was she would shut down the VM the host is basically silent and would hopefully have no LEDs ect on and look off when even when the host was on if the VM was off. She doesn't really do it to save power more just she puts things away when she is finished with them, and for electronics that means off.

I would then fear that she unplugs the power, thinking its off, on every lightning...at least thats what my grandmother always did with all electric devices...

Stupid idea...what about getting a normal desktop tower, putting an MiniITX motherboard in it with bare metal windows and then taping an additional MiniPC inside and routing the MiniPCs powercable and LAN cable through an open PCI bracket? Then she got a normal PC she could power down and the MiniPC could continue running the sevices unless she also unplugs the second powercable.

 

[DrNickDoom]

WIFI was a big problem and general stability with PCIe passthrough which changed from kernel to kernel. We also tried different laptops in order to get PCIe passthrough better. Most hardware was not built for it. This does not mean that it can't be done, but involves a LOT of work to get a combination of stuff that will work. Personally, I stopped using PCIe passthrough after this due to more problems than gain.

ye if in part I'm hoping for a stable solution it looks like its not the best idea, at least not atm

Depending on what you actually need: what about installing a "new router", that is OpenWRT-based with a bigger flash or even USB and jumpfrom this to whereever you need to go?

OpenWRT was going to be one one of the things to add to her server (but I'm less practiced with that then even Proxmox so it was a thing to add later but its a good idea "internet boxes" do get an exemption from her proclivity to turn things off

I would then fear that she unplugs the power, thinking its off, on every lightning...at least thats what my grandmother always did with all electric devices...

Stupid idea...what about getting a normal desktop tower, putting an MiniITX motherboard in it with bare metal windows and then taping an additional MiniPC inside and routing the MiniPCs powercable and LAN cable through an open PCI bracket? Then she got a normal PC she could power down and the MiniPC could continue running the sevices unless she also unplugs the second powercable.

honestly its posable but less likely, and if it is a stupid idea then we both are because i had thought about it as to my mum it would be no different then a VM on a server (i had even thought of using a thin client before and have the server out of the way but modem Wi-Fi cctv are all there so would mean routing all that to the new location so i kicked that in the head).

ATM the 2 PCs(probably with he 2nd hidden) looks like it will be used, it will still consolidate and tidy it up a lot up.

I'm going to still mess around with the idea from the post even if I'm never happy I could use that type of set up it seems like a project to keep playing around and learning proxmox, when not in production each problem is only an opportunity to learn lol

thanks for all the help